Donald Trump the Phenom

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marteezy
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Re: Donald Trump the Phenom

Postby marteezy » Sun Aug 30, 2015 10:34 am

chevyman58 wrote:
marteezy wrote:According to Pew Research, by nearly every measure, in every country aside from Russia, President Obama is more respected than his predecessor. The numbers don't lie. But if you rely on Fox and the Drudge Report of The Blaze for your information, then I understand your opinion. But when I look at these numbers, I see something different.
UK 53 - 76
France 42 - 83
Spain 33 - 58
Germany 31 - 73
Russia 46 - 11
Japan 50 - 66
Australia 46 - 81
China 41 - 44


Seriously? Can you NOT have ANY political discussion without pre-discrediting everyone that might challenge you by referencing FOX News????

Almost 7 years later & still using Bush as the benchmark for Obama? The Bush you hammer? High benchmark ............. sheesh.

How about a Link to the Poll? How about not GROSSLY misrepresenting the facts - then saying the numbers don't lie. Holy Cow MT .............

"every country aside from Russia" ???? "by nearly every measure" ???? Ever heard of Israel? Come on ........... "every country" .......... wow.

Bush is long gone. Thread's about Trump. But PLEASE link the Pew Poll you reference that you base your statements of facts upon.

I don't find one that definitive & specific.

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/20 ... ent-obama/

http://www.pewglobal.org/2012/06/13/glo ... s-faulted/

http://www.pewglobal.org/search/Bush+Ob ... al/page/6/


When grading a president you have to use his predecessor as the measuring stick. To compare him to himself or anyone else from the past makes no sense.

You also have to look at the situation an incoming president inherited. Therefore, you can't mention Obama's record without bringing Bush into the equation. Just like everyone that believes that Reagan was auch a great president always brings Carter into the discussion. Those principles cannot be avoided.

As for the links, thanks for finding one of the pew research links. The other was a similar link that did not show how Israel felt about Bush, that's why Israel wasn't included in my post.

That said to think that the use of diplomacy over military might makes someone a weak stick is pretty ignorant. Especially since the vast majority of Americans have not or will never serve in the military and risk their lives.

Being involved in wars and numerous military operations, I support as much diplomacy as possible. And if people are thick headed enough to feel that that makes a president or country look weak, then oh well. But we learned in the past that using military might recklessly makes us look like a bully. And we all know that no one respects a bully. And if your scared of someone you are more likely to attack what you are scared of.

Our geopolitical footing is much more secure than its been in quite awhile. While there are adversaries out there like ISIS/ISIL and numerous other terror organizations. Most of those are regional problems that pose no direct threat to us.

They do challenge some of our national interests, but not us directly. The countries that these groups terrorize should be the ones handling this situation. Lending support is one thing, but leading the charge is something that we should not do.

As we saw in Afghanistan, an asymmetric target is very dangerous and hard to fight. And ultimately the cost is not worth the effort
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Re: Donald Trump the Phenom

Postby mhardy_03 » Sun Aug 30, 2015 10:57 am

marteezy wrote:When grading a president you have to use his predecessor as the measuring stick. To compare him to himself or anyone else from the past makes no sense.

You also have to look at the situation an incoming president inherited. Therefore, you can't mention Obama's record without bringing Bush into the equation. Just like everyone that believes that Reagan was auch a great president always brings Carter into the discussion. Those principles cannot be avoided.

I'm staying 100% away from the meat of this discussion because I hate politics in the US, but this makes no sense to me. If you constantly rip on a guy during his entire tenure, basically claiming he is one of the worst presidents in history, then want to tout the next guy as doing a great job, you shouldn't compare him to that same guy.

After 7 years, the residue from the last guy is gone and it is on the current guy. Just like a coach getting fired for being terrible, then the next guy takes over his terrible situation. Say many years later when the coach has everything his way now, the team is still really bad, but slightly better than they were under the previous coach, does it still make sense to say he is doing well because he did better than the last guy? Hell no. I know it isn't a direct comparison but this is how I see it. 7 years into a presidency, Bush's stuff is mostly irrelevant. Stop comparing them. If things are only barely better now than they were under Bush and you thought Bush was feces, is Obama feces that was sprayed with perfume so it smells nice?
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Re: Donald Trump the Phenom

Postby marteezy » Sun Aug 30, 2015 3:54 pm

By nearly every measure, this country is in a better place today than we were seven years ago. Even when you compare the measurements from 2012 to today, you still see improvement. Just taking a quick look before I roll out for some family fun, unemployment has gone down, real GDP has increased and job growth has increased.

Unfortunately, the middle class is still struggling because of tax laws that still favor the nations wealthiest. People are still waiting for the trickle down to start. It hasn't started and it won't start. People are still waiting for those factory jobs that existed thirty years ago to return to America, news flash, they aren't coming back. If congress used as much effort on trying to find some middle ground with the president as they did trying to repeal ACA, then we'd see even more progress.

When your top political priority was to make Obama a one term president, you have a flawed agenda. And the fact that people refuse to acknowledge this is pretty sad.

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Re: Donald Trump the Phenom

Postby Tulcard » Sun Aug 30, 2015 5:38 pm

MT, you only see things through your liberal rose colored glasses. You've had your run. It will soon be over. Many of us see things a different way. We call it reality. I do, however, hope you had a fun Family outing.... 8-)
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Re: Donald Trump the Phenom

Postby chevyman58 » Sun Aug 30, 2015 7:33 pm

marteezy wrote:As for the links, thanks for finding one of the pew research links. The other was a similar link that did not show how Israel felt about Bush, that's why Israel wasn't included in my post.


Where's the link to the Pew Poll you referenced & grossly misrepresented ???

marteezy wrote:By nearly every measure, this country is in a better place today than we were seven years ago. Even when you compare the measurements from 2012 to today, you still see improvement.


There ya go again, "by nearly every measure" must be your new phrase for spreading hyperbole.

The problem I have had for years in trying to have a 'discussion' with you about anything is you do not know how to have a discussion. No idea, no interest in doing so - none. Most closed-minded poster I have ever encountered - on everything 'by nearly every measure'.

You don't come around to 'discuss' or to seek insight or to converse or to exchange perspectives. You simply post your self-defined 'truths', your self-defined 'facts' in a pompous, all-knowing manner. And stunningly, you typically pre-discredit those who might have differing opinion or might challenge your misrepresentations. They can't understand 'cause they're white. They can't understand 'cause they watch FOX News. They can't understand 'cause they're Republican. Etc., etc., etc.. Every time, every topic.

Sad, really. Your entrenched, defend-first closed-mindedness are a major portion of why this nation becomes further & further divided. At fault for nothing, no self-accountability, get to make up the facts along the way & support 'your side's' perspective no matter how ridiculous or false.

Sad. But since you won't even consider, ever, opening your mind to others' perspectives there's no where to go. But that's 'our' fault, not yours. Just like everything else you pontificate about. Always the other's fault. Always. Typical Lefty, so typical.

Somehow the Sheriff who got executed from behind by a Black guy in Houston on Friday while gassin' up his car contributed to his own execution. Somehow the cops getting murdered & gunned down on a weekly basis now aren't innocents. Somehow running around wearing 'Fu** The Police' t-shirts and intentionally initiating conflict with them is a warranted thing to do.

Somehow 'Black Lives Matter' but if one says 'white lives matter too' or 'all lives matter' in response they're vilified for it, they're racist. If someone says 'cops lives matter' they're hammered.

The country has more racial tension today, entitlements have doubled in the past 6 years & there's frequent, organized anarchy events.

But everything's better today, everything's improved.

OK ..............................................
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Re: Donald Trump the Phenom

Postby mhardy_03 » Sun Aug 30, 2015 7:38 pm

marteezy wrote:By nearly every measure, this country is in a better place today than we were seven years ago. Even when you compare the measurements from 2012 to today, you still see improvement. Just taking a quick look before I roll out for some family fun, unemployment has gone down, real GDP has increased and job growth has increased.

I agree with you that it is in some ways but significantly worse in others. But if you believe it to be true, then stop comparing the current president to the last one who you and many others considered to be worse than garbage. Just saying "well he was better than Bush" or "this problem was Bush's fault" is a cop out at best. Enough is enough. It has been 7 years. Many agree that Bush was bad, but whether Bush was bad or not doesn't affect Obama after 7 years. Hell it shouldn't after a couple years.
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Re: Donald Trump the Phenom

Postby marteezy » Mon Aug 31, 2015 1:23 am

Let's just agree to disagree on this Chev. We have different feelings and views on racism. We have different opinions and views on the President's role regarding the handling of race.

If he says nothing, he's not done enough, if he says anything he's race baiting.

What happened to that officer in Houston is absolutely horrible and has nothing to do with the Black Lives Matter movement. Just like Dillon Roof's actions didn't speak for the entire South.

Crazy people do crazy things. Insanity happens. But on both ends of the spectrum, the problem is rooted in the nations inability to deal with race. Ignoring the issue isn't dealing with it. Ignoring it is simply letting it fester.

We need to have frank and honest discussion on race and move forward from there.
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Re: Donald Trump the Phenom

Postby Elite1 » Fri Sep 11, 2015 1:42 am

I hope Dr. Ben Carson keeps the momentum going. He is a grass roots candidate and has gained traction, He is thoughtful and intelligent. I would love to have a non-career politician in office. Someone that is their own man, not beholden to unions, lobbyist, or corporations... Go Ben Go!
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Re: Donald Trump the Phenom

Postby Razz » Fri Sep 11, 2015 3:01 am

Elite1 wrote:I hope Dr. Ben Carson keeps the momentum going. He is a grass roots candidate and has gained traction, He is thoughtful and intelligent. I would love to have a non-career politician in office. Someone that is their own man, not beholden to unions or corporations... Go Ben Go!



It's still early but I'm leaning towards Carson as well. Not having political experience may hurt him. Not the fact that he's not a politician, but instead not knowing dealings of politicians. He is extremely smart though, so hopefully if he doesn't win, he can still make it rough on the others to do what's right.
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Re: Donald Trump the Phenom

Postby chevyman58 » Wed Sep 23, 2015 2:44 pm

Trump has hit the wall IMO. All downhill from here. He'll be done & gone by end of year IMO.
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Re: Donald Trump the Phenom

Postby EOCF » Wed Sep 23, 2015 10:08 pm

chevyman58 wrote:Trump has hit the wall IMO. All downhill from here. He'll be done & gone by end of year IMO.


Do you think he runs third party, or will his candle be completely burnt to where it doesn't matter? He's already saying that the GOP is instructing establishment candidates to gang up on him. I wouldn't doubt that he'd balk at the "loyalty pledge" and justify on the grounds that he was screwed by the party.
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Re: Donald Trump the Phenom

Postby Tulcard » Thu Sep 24, 2015 7:34 am

I think Trump will still be around for a while yet. We'll see what happens when he has to come forth with solid policies instead of rhetoric. I don't know if the Independents will be sold on his style.

I too like Carson. His heart is in the right place, but I fear his inexperience will do him in. I hope the media doesn't totally destroy him. They will try as they will with any Republican frontrunner. I think Bush, with all of his resources and success as a governor, is kind of meek and mild. A bit stale.

My darkhorse is Rubio. Sharp, on point and has the ability to express himself better than anyone else in either party.
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Re: Donald Trump the Phenom

Postby Tulcard » Thu Sep 24, 2015 7:37 am

I do hope that Trump doesn't let his ego get in the way of the Republican opportunity of winning the Presidency. I don't think he'll run as a 3rd party candidate and am not 100% sold he is not a Bill Clinton plant.... :shock:
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Re: Donald Trump the Phenom

Postby R27 » Thu Sep 24, 2015 11:19 am

The first election that I can actually vote and I get stuck with this group of candidates. Good job America. :lol:

Trump will stick around. As long as he's in the top couple candidates, there is no reason not to.

I've been disappointed by Rand Paul. I think he tried to play the good Republican early on and is now trying to jump back on the Libertarian train to differentiate himself. I find it hard to get excited about him now because I no longer know what he is. Fiorina and Carson remain interesting to me.
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Re: Donald Trump the Phenom

Postby chevyman58 » Thu Sep 24, 2015 11:50 am

Tulcard wrote:I do hope that Trump doesn't let his ego get in the way of the Republican opportunity of winning the Presidency.


Too late.

I think it's intentional, I think he wants out.

No matter your ego, no matter how thin your own skin is, ya don't relentlessly crap all over the most popular FOX News host then crap on your old friend & host of the highest-rated cable tv news show for years now - also on FOX News - IF you're seriously trying to win nomination. No way.

This continued attack on Megyn Kelly is completely contrived & baseless. Now his dump on O'Reilly & boycott of FOX News is completely self-destructive. He knows that, he's not stupid.

So no EOCF - I don't think he runs as an Independent - I think that was all a contrived bluff. Then signing the pledge gave him an out so when he bails he can say he can't run as an Independent because he's a man of his word.

I think he's scared to death, he's gotten in too deep and he's orchestrating a path out where he can blame others. I really do.

This 'outsider' stuff, perhaps unfortunately, will run it's course. They'll all fall away & a career politician will get the nomination.

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