Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Your place for everything about the St. Louis Cardinals.
User avatar
EOCF
Everyday Starter
Everyday Starter
Posts: 794
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2015 8:33 pm
Location: Normal, Illinois

Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby EOCF » Sun Oct 02, 2016 6:11 pm

This is the thread for "idle speculation" about what you would like to see happen this winter. The links below will help you build your ideal 2017 25 man roster.

This should be more fun than the last few years. It seems likely that big changes may be on the way.

2016-17 MLB Free Agents
Cardinals' 40 Man Roster
Projected Arbitration Salaries for each team

I'll update as more relevant links surface. Winter has come early this year. Stay warm folks.
Last edited by EOCF on Mon Oct 10, 2016 5:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
CSFBL: New York River Pirates: (2037-2120)
46 Playoff appearances, 24 Division titles, 12 League titles
2053, 2057, 2058, 2074, 2090, 2113, 2114, 2116 & 2118 World Champions
cardinalfan4life
Everyday Starter
Everyday Starter
Posts: 404
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 8:06 pm

Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby cardinalfan4life » Mon Oct 03, 2016 3:54 pm

Really nothing useful in this FA class to retool this roster.
User avatar
EOCF
Everyday Starter
Everyday Starter
Posts: 794
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2015 8:33 pm
Location: Normal, Illinois

Re: RE: Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby EOCF » Mon Oct 03, 2016 4:56 pm

cardinalfan4life wrote:Really nothing useful in this FA class to retool this roster.

That's a ridiculous and shortsighted generalization dude. Just because there isn't an obvious star doesn't mean it's devoid of talent. The market for starting pitching is awful, but the club doesn't need that.

The trade market is where Mo makes his money anyways. Free agency will be used to address smaller issues.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk
CSFBL: New York River Pirates: (2037-2120)
46 Playoff appearances, 24 Division titles, 12 League titles
2053, 2057, 2058, 2074, 2090, 2113, 2114, 2116 & 2118 World Champions
cardinalfan4life
Everyday Starter
Everyday Starter
Posts: 404
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 8:06 pm

Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby cardinalfan4life » Mon Oct 03, 2016 8:14 pm

uhh, actually, we do need Starting Pitching. our team ER.A for this season is 4.08. we allowed hitters to hit, for rounded terms .260 against our staff. if we go by ESPNs team stats were a top-5 offensive team in 2016, but middle of the road in our overall pitching staff.

heres why were sitting home in October: our defense is 25th overall in baseball among all 30 clubs, very few teams played worst than us in the field in 2016

Dont believe me? CLICK HERE
User avatar
EOCF
Everyday Starter
Everyday Starter
Posts: 794
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2015 8:33 pm
Location: Normal, Illinois

Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby EOCF » Mon Oct 03, 2016 8:40 pm

Wainwright, Leake, Wacha and Garcia all underachieved badly and dealt with injuries this year. It's unlikely that all four of them will be equally bad/hurt in 2017.

Lynn, Cooney, Lyons and Gonzales missed all or most of 2016 with injury. Lynn is a lock for the rotation and the other all have the ability to be quality MLB starters.

CMart was a stud this year and there isn't any reason to think he will regress much, if at all. Reyes was a stud in limited action and while a learning curve is expected, he's still a top prospect.

That's 10 starters that could be under contract for 2017. I didn't even touch on how bad the defense was this year. If the club has even average range in the middle infield next year, this ground ball heavy staff is looking at a HUGE improvement.

It's not a stretch to envision every one of the above guys as a workhorse that keeps an ERA well under 4.00. Five of them have done it at the major league level
The other five have all done it in the minors. I don't know that you can find another team in the big leagues that can match that depth. The pitching will work itself out.

What the club needs to focus on is shoring up the defense and finding some players that will get on base a reasonable clip. Gyrko, Moss, Holliday and Grichuk all provided 20+ home run power but hit between .220 and .240. In 2015 you had multiple guys batting around .300 but the power wasn't there. If the club finds some lineup balance, it could win 100 games next year.
CSFBL: New York River Pirates: (2037-2120)
46 Playoff appearances, 24 Division titles, 12 League titles
2053, 2057, 2058, 2074, 2090, 2113, 2114, 2116 & 2118 World Champions
User avatar
chevyman58
Pitching Coach
Pitching Coach
Posts: 3233
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2015 5:36 pm
Location: Austin, Texas

Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby chevyman58 » Tue Oct 04, 2016 7:40 am

Unlikely Lynn can be counted on to just roll out to 200 innings. I'd not be surprised to see him start in the Pen for awhile.

I'd like to see Rosenthal given consideration as a starter.
User avatar
EOCF
Everyday Starter
Everyday Starter
Posts: 794
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2015 8:33 pm
Location: Normal, Illinois

Re: RE: Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby EOCF » Tue Oct 04, 2016 10:49 am

chevyman58 wrote:Unlikely Lynn can be counted on to just roll out to 200 innings. I'd not be surprised to see him start in the Pen for awhile.

I'd like to see Rosenthal given consideration as a starter.

I don't disagree Chev. Putting Rosenthal in the conversation as a starter only reinforces my point that the club has no reason to explore free agency for starting pitching. Cashing some of that depth in for a run at an elite starter could be an option though.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk
CSFBL: New York River Pirates: (2037-2120)
46 Playoff appearances, 24 Division titles, 12 League titles
2053, 2057, 2058, 2074, 2090, 2113, 2114, 2116 & 2118 World Champions
User avatar
R27
Franchise Player
Franchise Player
Posts: 2479
Joined: Fri Jul 03, 2015 11:50 pm
Location: North Carolina
Contact:

Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby R27 » Tue Oct 04, 2016 11:05 am

chevyman58 wrote:Unlikely Lynn can be counted on to just roll out to 200 innings. I'd not be surprised to see him start in the Pen for awhile.

Given what I heard about him when they shut down his 2016 comeback hopes in September, he was already throwing mid-90s. That bodes really well for him with a regular offseason and already having much of his velocity back. Unlike Motte and Wainwright, who had their surgeries in February/March, Lynn has his a few months earlier in November. And it seems he's healed well. I don't think he'll get to 200 innings either, but I think my hopes of starting him in the bullpen are super small right now.

The real question is what Mo is going to do in left field. He wouldn't let Holliday go if he doesn't know what he's going to do there already.

It is slim pickings on the free agent market this winter, but there are some interesting guys there who could add to your team.

I'd be interested in Luis Valbuena. Left handed, can play 1B/2B/3B. Can be a good backup option if Gyorko and/or Wong take big steps back next year. He's flashed some power too, had 13 HR in half a season before his hamstring ended his season in July.

I'd also see about Carlos Beltran if he'd be interested in a one year deal as a backup corner outfielder, pinch hit option.
@JonDobleRBD - Redbird Dugout

El gato es en fuego en mi pantelones.
cardinalfan4life
Everyday Starter
Everyday Starter
Posts: 404
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 8:06 pm

Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby cardinalfan4life » Tue Oct 04, 2016 3:13 pm

also, everybody keeps forgetting Luke Weaver. as I've said for the past month, "Don't throw out the baby, just change the bathwater". We need a #1, we don't have one. Wonder what it would take for Sale? Id target a legit #1....Martinez is a #2 to me. My top trade target, left life far to soon, I would of loved to seen Jose Fernandez in a cardinal uni, but...its not meant to be.

Who, could we possibly get to shore up, the worst defense in MLB? intrigued by the UTL guy..but..how's his glove? .
User avatar
Elite1
Bench Warmer
Bench Warmer
Posts: 152
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2015 2:07 pm
Location: Camarillo, California

Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby Elite1 » Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:30 pm

I was just looking at some pitching stats... I have always liked the stat, "quality starts". IMO, if a pitcher gives his club a quality start, that is really all you can ask of a starting pitcher. ERA and Whip can be easily skewed, if you have one or two really bad outings. If you look at our starters number of quality starts, compared to the number of games started, we can see who really helped and hurt their team. Yes, most of our staff under performed. I hate to point fingers, but one of our starting pitchers, really stunk it up, based on QS's! http://www.espn.com/mlb/team/stats/pitc ... order/true
User avatar
R27
Franchise Player
Franchise Player
Posts: 2479
Joined: Fri Jul 03, 2015 11:50 pm
Location: North Carolina
Contact:

Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby R27 » Wed Oct 05, 2016 5:01 pm

cardinalfan4life wrote:also, everybody keeps forgetting Luke Weaver. as I've said for the past month, "Don't throw out the baby, just change the bathwater". We need a #1, we don't have one. Wonder what it would take for Sale? Id target a legit #1....Martinez is a #2 to me. My top trade target, left life far to soon, I would of loved to seen Jose Fernandez in a cardinal uni, but...its not meant to be.

Who, could we possibly get to shore up, the worst defense in MLB? intrigued by the UTL guy..but..how's his glove? .

Next year is the year that Martinez takes the step to be a #1. This year he showed everything he needed to show. He could beat you by blowing it past you. He could beat you by mixing it up. He could beat you when he didn't have his best stuff. Next year, no workload restrictions. You can let him go. I'm looking for big things out of him.

I don't think anyone's forgotten Weaver, just that given what he did last year in the big leagues, he stacks up behind Wainwright, Martinez, Leake, Lynn, Garcia, Wacha, and Reyes. And don't forget Gonzales and Cooney too. So he's at least 8th in line for a rotation spot, maybe 10th.

The White Sox have to be asking the world for Sale, otherwise he'd already be gone. But I think you could package Eaton at a group discount, perhaps. Not the CF who will relieve Grichuk like Mozeliak said he wanted today, but could be a great left fielder.
@JonDobleRBD - Redbird Dugout

El gato es en fuego en mi pantelones.
User avatar
R27
Franchise Player
Franchise Player
Posts: 2479
Joined: Fri Jul 03, 2015 11:50 pm
Location: North Carolina
Contact:

Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby R27 » Wed Oct 05, 2016 5:22 pm

As far as what was said today, Link. Lots of good bullet points at the bottom of the article that cover a lot of information that will shape the winter.

Just some thoughts.

Given what they say, I expect Rosenthal to get work as a starter next spring. They were asked about it and didn't close the door. Given the belief that there's a handshake agreement between the Cardinals and Rosenthal to keep him the closer in order to get him to accept the reliever role and with Oh positioned to be the team's closer going forward, it makes sense.

Grichuk needs to stay in center field. Offensively, Grichuk was a 103 OPS+ compared to center fielders. Defensively, he wasn't great, but he certainly wasn't bad. The bottomline is that if he's only an average offensive center fielder, there is no way he's going to be even that as a left fielder because left fielders generally hit better than center fielders.
@JonDobleRBD - Redbird Dugout

El gato es en fuego en mi pantelones.
User avatar
chevyman58
Pitching Coach
Pitching Coach
Posts: 3233
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2015 5:36 pm
Location: Austin, Texas

Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby chevyman58 » Thu Oct 06, 2016 6:45 am

Glad Mo read my Rosenthal suggestion. If he'd call me, I've got some more advice.

Unless Grichuk works his tail off this Winter like JJay did & vastly improves his defense he'll continue to be a liability in CF IMO.
User avatar
EOCF
Everyday Starter
Everyday Starter
Posts: 794
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2015 8:33 pm
Location: Normal, Illinois

Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby EOCF » Mon Oct 10, 2016 5:08 pm

Just updated the original post with projected 2017 salaries for those who are eligible for arbitration. Here's the breakdown for those who are interested in "creating" a fiscally accurate roster.

Trevor Rosenthal (4.058) – $6.3MM
Matt Adams (4.033) – $2.8MM
Seth Maness (3.154) – $1.6MM
Kevin Siegrist (3.116) – $1.9MM
Carlos Martinez (3.073) – $5.3MM
Michael Wacha (3.062) – $3.2MM
CSFBL: New York River Pirates: (2037-2120)
46 Playoff appearances, 24 Division titles, 12 League titles
2053, 2057, 2058, 2074, 2090, 2113, 2114, 2116 & 2118 World Champions
User avatar
chevyman58
Pitching Coach
Pitching Coach
Posts: 3233
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2015 5:36 pm
Location: Austin, Texas

Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby chevyman58 » Fri Oct 14, 2016 9:04 am

The price of qualifying offers for Major League Baseball free agents will be $17.2 million this year.

The figure, announced Thursday, is up 8.9 percent from $15.8 million last year. It was determined by the average of the top 125 major league contracts this year by average annual value.

Return to “St. Louis Cardinals”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest