Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

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Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby chevyman58 » Fri Dec 09, 2016 11:59 am

If you look at Fowler/Diaz/Carp that's 3 guys all with OBP above .360. Add Piscotty @ .343 last yr & .359 in '15 that's a healthy top 4.

I think the probs begin when ya hit the 5-hole. I know many think Gyorko isn't a 150-game guy. And, frankly, Adams has an overall better career line that Jed does by a pretty fair margin. Ideally a Gyorko/Adams platoon Lefty/Righty looks best on paper but I can't see Adams anywhere but 1B. And by all accounts Mo has committed 1B to Carp on an everyday basis.

So ................. WT* we gonna do?
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Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby BrewCards » Fri Dec 09, 2016 12:26 pm

We need the combo of Peralta/Gyorko/Grichuk to provide some power. Unless they do bring in Turner or trade for Frazier or something.
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Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby R27 » Fri Dec 09, 2016 12:31 pm

You can flip flop Carpenter and Diaz here, but I hope this is the alignment they settle on and alongside my rough estimates for what I'd expect from them. Third is less important than second and fourth in the lineup. And with Fowler and Carpenter at the top basically playing double lead off, you could legitimately see Diaz working in the first inning with the starting pitcher having already thrown 20 pitches.

Unlikely, but I also would love to see them put Wong in the 9 spot next year and commit to him there. You put three leadoff guys in a row for successive innings and you've got Wong and Fowler both with good speed on the bases too.

CF Fowler (.270/.370/.425, 10 HR)
1B Carpenter (.270/.380/.500, 20 HR)
SS Diaz (.280/.350/.475, 15 HR)
RF Piscotty (.280/.350/.450, 20 HR)
C Molina (.280/.340/.425, 5 HR)
LF Grichuk (.250/.300/.500, 25 HR)
3B Peralta (.270/.330/.450, 15 HR)
2B Wong (.250/.340/.425, 10 HR)
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Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby Tulcard » Fri Dec 09, 2016 12:48 pm

BrewCards wrote:We need the combo of Peralta/Gyorko/Grichuk to provide some power. Unless they do bring in Turner or trade for Frazier or something.


We have plenty of guys who can hammer the ball. Carp., Diaz, Grichuk, Piscotty & Gyorko can all hit 25+ HR's & drive in runs. We now have the table setter, or ignition switch in Fowler. You never know and I'd love to have Turner (not just for his offense, but for a step up defensively @ 3B), but I highly doubt Mo is going to ante up more $$ or trade any prospects. We just lost our draft pick by signing Fowler....just my thoughts.... 8-)
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Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby chevyman58 » Fri Dec 09, 2016 1:23 pm

R27 wrote: 2B Wong (.250/.340/.425, 10 HR)
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I love your optimism on Wong, love it.

But it's gonna take either a miracle or all of us taking daily hits off the crack pipe for him to OBP @ .340. The 9-hole will help, his OB% got buoyed last year because he finally started accepting some BBs. But .340 would be a leap for him as a full-time player IMO.
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Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby R27 » Fri Dec 09, 2016 1:40 pm

The Wong projection is in line with what we got from him after he returned. It is an optimistic play on him, but he has the skills and ability to do it. He just has to put a whole season together.

Updated payroll chart. $141M for the Opening Day 25.

The 25+MLB DL+dead money is $149.5, which is up about $6M from last year.

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Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby EOCF » Fri Dec 09, 2016 2:48 pm

Slap on $17-20M for Turner and call it a day ;)

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Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby BrewCards » Fri Dec 09, 2016 3:12 pm

The thing that sticks out to me is the lack of OF depth. Lost Holliday, Moss, Hazelbaker. Wong must be the 5th OF. I guess Jose Martinez is the guy if there is an injury?
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Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby mhardy_03 » Fri Dec 09, 2016 3:16 pm

EOCF wrote:Slap on $17-20M for Turner and call it a day ;)

Or 20 for Encarnacion as Bowden apparently said that he doesn't even have 3/60 at this point. Find takers for Peralta and Adams.
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Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby marteezy » Fri Dec 09, 2016 4:03 pm

BrewCards wrote:The thing that sticks out to me is the lack of OF depth. Lost Holliday, Moss, Hazelbaker. Wong must be the 5th OF. I guess Jose Martinez is the guy if there is an injury?


I like the fact that there are fewer options available on the bench. I'd like to see Matheny use a more consistent lineup. Too many options cripples him because he tries to do too much.

That said, I'd try to sign Encarnacion to a one or two year deal with a good chunk of change and an option and trade Peralta and Adams to simply gain some organizational depth.
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Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby chevyman58 » Fri Dec 09, 2016 4:50 pm

Not gonna trade Peralta unless prepared to send a majority of his pay with him.

Adams should have substantial value,

I think we're going to continue to see younger players get a shot on the Big Club sooner than they have in the past.
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Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby Razz » Sat Dec 10, 2016 10:28 am

I'd be all in to give Encarnacion 3yr / 54 which comes out to 18 million a year, and would go up to 20 if we had to. He'd be a legitimate cleanup hitter. Move Carpenter back to third and have Wong and Gyorko split time at second.

I would still like to see a trade for Quintana as a starter. I realize the odds of that happening are slim to non, but I'm not comfortable with Waino getting older, Lynn coming off TJ, and Leake in general. I know we have a lot of arms that can step in, but IMO they're not the quality arms we need at the top of the rotation. If we were to get Quintana, it moves Leake to the bullpen for one season, until Lynn moves on next season. Leake would be good backup for injuries to the staff.
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Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby EOCF » Sat Dec 10, 2016 10:59 am

If the Sox weren't cleaning house on every fire sale trade they made I'd think about it. Quintana probably doesn't come to St. Louis without giving up Reyes though. That's moving backwords IMO.

Also, don't underestimate a better defense doing wonders for Leake and Wainwright.

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Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby EOCF » Sat Dec 10, 2016 1:55 pm

Razz, Here is what the Sox wanted from the 'Stros for Quintana.

Essentially the 29th, 50th and 86th top prospects in the game. That's pretty brutal.

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Re: Official: 2016 Cardinals' Be The GM Thread

Postby chevyman58 » Sat Dec 10, 2016 2:53 pm

Good point on better defense helping the starting staff.

Couple points for the optimist in most of us:

I don't see the Cubs' rotation duplicating '16. Were stunningly good, were injury-free.

Similarly, I think we've got to be better than we were in '16.

I hate to say it, but for the 3rd year in-a-row & for the foreseeable future I think our path to success relies on our ability to beat the Cubs.

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