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Re: 2017 Offseason News Thread

Posted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 6:52 pm
by mhardy_03
chevyman58 wrote:So, if Ozuna rakes like last year, he's gonna be maybe a $14M+ Arb guy next year & $19M+ Arb guy in 2019 right?

Not cheap. The days of riding great young performers for a long time on the cheap are gone.

One can see why they roll the dice early on long-term deals with the Craigs, Carps, Piscottys, CMarts of the world. If they hit gold on a reasonable % of these guys they can eat the flameouts & still be millions ahead.

Unfortunately Ozuna only has 2 years of control remaining including this year. So 1 more year after this. Hopefully he does do well in 2018 and we have to pay him 14M+ in 2019!

Re: 2017 Offseason News Thread

Posted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:01 pm
by chevyman58
Unfortunately Ozuna only has 2 years of control remaining including this year. So 1 more year after this. Hopefully he does do well in 2018 and we have to pay him 14M+ in 2019!

I thought he was Arb2 this year & had 2 more years thereafter.

Re: 2017 Offseason News Thread

Posted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:14 pm
by mhardy_03
chevyman58 wrote:Unfortunately Ozuna only has 2 years of control remaining including this year. So 1 more year after this. Hopefully he does do well in 2018 and we have to pay him 14M+ in 2019!

I thought he was Arb2 this year & had 2 more years thereafter.

He is arb2 but was not a super 2 so he only gets 3 arb years.

Re: 2017 Offseason News Thread

Posted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:18 pm
by R27
cardinalfan4life wrote:Imagine if some young guy puts up Pujols in his prime numbers, the amount he'd get now if teams are paying somebody 11 million for ONE GOOD YEAR

You'd get a contract like Mike Trout's $144M/6 contract. He got $1M as a second year player. Then started the big deal making $6M as a third year player. He made $7.5 million before he even got into arbitration. I'm not going to make sure, but that's probably a record.

Then you have Kris Bryant as a Super Two setting the Arb1 record at $10.85 million. And he's got three more arb years, so watch those records fall because Boras is going to squeeze every cent out of the Cubs for the games they played with Bryant's service time.

$11M is nothing. Gyorko's going to be making more that that here soon on the tail end of a contract he signed after his second year in the big leagues, which was horrible.

And Ozuna didn't just have "ONE GOOD YEAR." He's had two good years and then one great year. His good years are easily worth $9 million. If we get another great one, it's a deal.

Re: 2017 Offseason News Thread

Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 7:08 am
by chevyman58
R27 wrote:IMO, Jeter needs to not be judged on what he's doing this winter.


According to Fish Stripes, Moncaleano is hoping to get one million signatures on his petition, which was launched on Jan. 6 and can be found at Care2. The petition begins with Moncaleano “calling on all South Floridians to stand up for themselves and our community.” He says his ultimate goal is to have Jeter and Sherman removed from their positions as Marlins owners.

The petition has over 300,000 signatures in one week. The goal is to reach one million by opening day. The group has also set up an Instagram page titled marlinsfansunite.

Much More Here - https://sports.yahoo.com/marlins-fan-or ... 32978.html

Re: 2017 Offseason News Thread

Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 8:42 am
by JRM3888
That's ridiculous. It's like they've already forgotten that they had the worst owner in sports for 15 years.

Re: 2017 Offseason News Thread

Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:15 am
by Tulcard
With Addison Reed signing a 2 year deal with the Twins another potential BP arm is now out of play. "For Now" it looks like King Mozeliak has decided to at least begin ST with the BP arms we have hinting that initially Gregerson will be slated as our closer. We'll have to see how things play out as we do have Reyes returning approximately in early May and do have Tyler Lyons who could close. They will also take a look at Jordan Hicks and Ryan Helsley with their young power arms.

As stated in the article below, in 2017 the Cardinals blew 41 leads. They had 101 games decided by 3 runs or less and went 48-53 in those games. They also lost 29 of 53 one run games. Just like the offense needs a "feared" hitter or two in the lineup, the BP needs arms that when we reach the 7th, 8th & 9th innings the opponent knows that we have arms that can lock the game down. Not sure we have this at present. That's why we have ST I guess. To identify weaknesses and hopefully be able to shore them up instead of hoping the current cast will or can do the job. Perhaps all is good. Reyes eventually being in the pen would surely help. Perhaps at some point during the season the young arms will contribute. We'll see. Long way to go.

http://www.stltoday.com/sports/baseball ... 62972.html

Re: 2017 Offseason News Thread

Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 11:26 am
by mhardy_03
I've consistently thought they were still in the market for more upgrades even while saying they weren't. I'm beginning to doubt this now with Reed signing for that small of a contract. And if they don't do anything else I will be pretty upset.

Re: 2017 Offseason News Thread

Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 11:41 am
by Tulcard
Perhaps they still are going to do something and are waiting for the market to soften and for players/agents demands to come down. We all know the starting staff is questionable and now it seems they are content to go to ST at least with what they have. Then go flea market shopping. Sure would like to have another solid starter and even a Tony Watson for the pen. You can't pin all your hopes on Alex Reyes.

Re: 2017 Offseason News Thread

Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:23 pm
by R27
mhardy_03 wrote:I've consistently thought they were still in the market for more upgrades even while saying they weren't. I'm beginning to doubt this now with Reed signing for that small of a contract. And if they don't do anything else I will be pretty upset.

Mo said yesterday that they're proceeding with Gregerson as the closer and planning to use prospects, he was talking up Halsey and Hicks, I believe, to fill the bullpen.

This front office is the absolute worst. If the Cardinals were truly happy with their internal options, why didn't they tell us that in November? They could have said, "We really like Tyler Lyons and think he is capable of being the closer, so depending on the opportunities that present themselves this winter we expect that he'll get first crack at the job in the spring. But we do know we need some help out there, so we'll be looking to add some back end of the bullpen guys to add some depth." But instead they told us of their intentions to add multiple relievers, including an established closer.

They sign Gregerson and call it a day. Gregerson has three years of ERA decline. Lost his closing job. And couldn't buy a meaningful postseason inning despite a 0 ERA for him and a near 6 ERA for the rest of the Astros bullpen. So if they're wondering why we don't trust the internal options, it's because they told us not to.

Best part. Ozuna, Reed, and Nicasio combined would cost the Cardinals $26M this year. Stanton is making $25M. So signing Reed and Nicasio and bringing in Ozuna would have cost them barely more than they were willing to spend for Stanton alone.

So we're left with two options. 1) Mozeliak and his front office team aren't as smart as we think they are since they are constantly caught unaware regarding the cost of acquisitions or 2) they're intentionally lying to us. Which the latter honestly makes little sense since they could easily frame what they're actually doing better and the vast majority of fans would buy into it.

They could have gone and left no doubt this winter. Mozeliak said yesterday that he doesn't feel like anyone is head and shoulders above anyone else in our division. Which to me reads as "We're happy to be in the thick of it, but have no interest in being the clear favorites in the division." It wouldn't have taken much to be, either. And the ultimately irony is going "aggressive" to get Ozuna and then leaving obvious holes in the rest of your ball club. It's like buying a flashy car while the bank forecloses on your mortgage.

Re: 2017 Offseason News Thread

Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:21 pm
by Topps
Yadi expects to hang them up after 2020

Better start passing that knowledge on to Kelly now. Crazy to think that Yadi can be done in 3 years.

Re: 2017 Offseason News Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:00 am
by chevyman58
I don't know who our next cornerstone player is. Yadi has defined our identity since Albert/TLR left. Concerns me greatly.

Re: 2017 Offseason News Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 12:17 pm
by EOCF
chevyman58 wrote:I don't know who our next cornerstone player is. Yadi has defined our identity since Albert/TLR left. Concerns me greatly.


The club obviously hopes it's Cmart and Ozuna. 3 years is a long time too. Reyes, Weaver, Flaherty, Hudson and Hicks have a lot of potential. There is a huge dearth of young, offensive, cornerstone talent though. Kelly should be a rock solid catcher, but a lot of his value lies in his defense. Delvin Perez still has the most hitting upside in the organization IMO, but he's far from a sure thing. A guy like O'Neil is probably your next best bet? That's disheartening.

Re: 2017 Offseason News Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 2:18 pm
by chevyman58
I don't have a lot of optimism they'll retain Ozuna long-term.

Re: 2017 Offseason News Thread

Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2018 5:45 am
by chevyman58
R27 wrote: This front office is the absolute worst.


Bill DeWitt Jr. suggested on Monday that the organization has wrapped up the bulk of its winter work: "I don't really anticipate a major move between now and Spring Training."