Game 85: Marlins @ Cardinals, 7/6/17, 12:45 pm

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Game 85: Marlins @ Cardinals, 7/6/17, 12:45 pm

Postby R27 » Thu Jul 06, 2017 11:55 am

RHP Tom Koehler (1-3, 8.33 ERA) vs RHP Michael Wacha (5-3, 4.16 ERA)

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2B Matt Carpenter
CF Tommy Pham
RF Jose Martinez
3B Jedd Gyorko
C Yadier Molina
1B Luke Voit
LF Randal Grichuk
SS Greg Garcia
RHP Michael Wacha

Matheny skips the opportunity to put three members of the Cardinals' 2012 draft class in the same lineup. Piscotty, Mejia, and Wacha. Barraclough, who pitched the last two nights for Miami, is also a member. As is Carson Kelly and Tim Cooney.

And I still don't understand why Grichuk plays over Martinez, but Martinez slots in 3rd and Grichuk 7th when they're both playing.
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Re: Game 85: Marlins @ Cardinals, 7/6/17, 12:45 pm

Postby chevyman58 » Thu Jul 06, 2017 2:03 pm

Mo said Grichuk was going to come back up, go in the lineup & sink or swim this time around. Mo was surprisingly (IMO) candid that Grichuk would have this oppty to prove his worth or not. IMO if he doesn't produce at a high level this time around he's gone, done in STL.
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Re: Game 85: Marlins @ Cardinals, 7/6/17, 12:45 pm

Postby chevyman58 » Thu Jul 06, 2017 5:49 pm

Cards win 4-3, split the series. Oh with the Save, Luke with a solo HR. 2B, 3RBI, Grichuk with a solo HR that turns out to be the game-winner.
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Re: Game 85: Marlins @ Cardinals, 7/6/17, 12:45 pm

Postby mhardy_03 » Thu Jul 06, 2017 8:58 pm

The Voit HR was a BOMB. And the 2B he went down and away to get it and hit it over the RF. Pretty impressive day.
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Re: Game 85: Marlins @ Cardinals, 7/6/17, 12:45 pm

Postby R27 » Thu Jul 06, 2017 9:23 pm

chevyman58 wrote:Mo said Grichuk was going to come back up, go in the lineup & sink or swim this time around. Mo was surprisingly (IMO) candid that Grichuk would have this oppty to prove his worth or not. IMO if he doesn't produce at a high level this time around he's gone, done in STL.

I don't actually think Grichuk was supposed to come up yet, but the injury with Fowler kinda forced their hand a bit.

The crazy part is that when Grichuk has done something, it's been from a critical lineup position. He's hitting .209/.277/.465 with 3 home runs in 11 games since he was called back up. But look at this...

In the 2nd or 4th spot, he's played four games and hit .444/.474/1.056 (yes, over 1.000 slugging).

In the 6th or 7th spot, he's played seven games now and is hitting .069/.129/.172.

Stark difference. He's one of the few guys the Cardinals have this season that's shown he's capable of hitting at the front of the lineup, and yet he gets buried in the back. Guys see different pitches up in the lineup, I think he gets pitched differently at the front of the lineup than he does in the back where he's being protected by the likes of Greg Garcia.
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Re: Game 85: Marlins @ Cardinals, 7/6/17, 12:45 pm

Postby R27 » Thu Jul 06, 2017 11:32 pm

Just a glimpse since I need to expand my sample size to the whole season to see if it stands up before I finish an article at Redbird Dugout, but on Grichuk... 67% of the pitches he's seen since his return in the front half of the lineup have been strikes. Just 44% have been strikes in the back half. They are effectively trying to pitch around him in the back of the lineup.
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Re: Game 85: Marlins @ Cardinals, 7/6/17, 12:45 pm

Postby mhardy_03 » Thu Jul 06, 2017 11:38 pm

They definitely didn't pitch around him today. In the 2 AB that I saw, he swing through 3 fastballs in the strike zone (1 down the middle) for a strikeout in one AB. In the next one he swing through a fastball down the middle before squaring up the fastball down the middle for the HR. He has a pretty huge hole in his swing and until that is fixed he won't show much improvement IMO.
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Re: Game 85: Marlins @ Cardinals, 7/6/17, 12:45 pm

Postby R27 » Fri Jul 07, 2017 9:30 am

mhardy_03 wrote:They definitely didn't pitch around him today. In the 2 AB that I saw, he swing through 3 fastballs in the strike zone (1 down the middle) for a strikeout in one AB. In the next one he swing through a fastball down the middle before squaring up the fastball down the middle for the HR. He has a pretty huge hole in his swing and until that is fixed he won't show much improvement IMO.

That's more strikes than he has been getting. Last night 11 of the 16 (69%) pitches he saw were strikes. Compared to Tuesday night where just three of the 15 (20%) pitches he saw were strikes and he struck out twice.

They pitched him differently between his strikeout and his home run. Maybe because his strikeout came with two out already and they challenged him? It's not often he gets three straight strikes, let alone all fastballs.

Bottom line is that he needs to stop swinging at balls. But will he ever make that leap? I doubt it.

The bigger problem I see is that a lot of up and coming Cardinals players have little command of the strike zone. Grichuk, Diaz, DeJong. All are guys who hack away and don't work counts. So we get guys who are either hitting the ball or slumping.

Say what you will about Jon Jay, he might have slumped at times where you'd see his batting average around .200, but that OBP was usually still north of .300.
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Re: Game 85: Marlins @ Cardinals, 7/6/17, 12:45 pm

Postby mhardy_03 » Fri Jul 07, 2017 10:37 am

He does need to stop swinging at balls, but when you aren't making contact on strikes either, you are never going to be much.
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Re: Game 85: Marlins @ Cardinals, 7/6/17, 12:45 pm

Postby chevyman58 » Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:23 am

Said it prior to, said it then, said it since, say it now:

SHOULD HAVE LEFT JJ IN CF & NOT HAVE LET THE HATERS RUN HIM OUTA TOWN.

http://m.mlb.com/player/445055/jon-jay
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Re: Game 85: Marlins @ Cardinals, 7/6/17, 12:45 pm

Postby mhardy_03 » Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:48 am

chevyman58 wrote:Said it prior to, said it then, said it since, say it now:

SHOULD HAVE LEFT JJ IN CF & NOT HAVE LET THE HATERS RUN HIM OUTA TOWN.

http://m.mlb.com/player/445055/jon-jay

And if we kept him, we don't have Gyorko and likely don't have him either as he would have been a free agent after last year anyway and coming off 2 straight poor seasons.
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Re: Game 85: Marlins @ Cardinals, 7/6/17, 12:45 pm

Postby R27 » Fri Jul 07, 2017 12:06 pm

mhardy_03 wrote:
chevyman58 wrote:Said it prior to, said it then, said it since, say it now:

SHOULD HAVE LEFT JJ IN CF & NOT HAVE LET THE HATERS RUN HIM OUTA TOWN.

http://m.mlb.com/player/445055/jon-jay

And if we kept him, we don't have Gyorko and likely don't have him either as he would have been a free agent after last year anyway and coming off 2 straight poor seasons.

We wouldn't have Gyorko. But Jay only had one poor season and that was due to his wrist surgery. The second season of that deal, he was hitting .296/.345/.407 and leading the NL in doubles when he was hit by the pitch that broke his arm.

Stupid part is he's outplaying Schwarber, Almora, and Heyward, but is still a bench player.
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Re: Game 85: Marlins @ Cardinals, 7/6/17, 12:45 pm

Postby mhardy_03 » Fri Jul 07, 2017 12:21 pm

R27 wrote:
mhardy_03 wrote:
chevyman58 wrote:Said it prior to, said it then, said it since, say it now:

SHOULD HAVE LEFT JJ IN CF & NOT HAVE LET THE HATERS RUN HIM OUTA TOWN.

http://m.mlb.com/player/445055/jon-jay

And if we kept him, we don't have Gyorko and likely don't have him either as he would have been a free agent after last year anyway and coming off 2 straight poor seasons.

We wouldn't have Gyorko. But Jay only had one poor season and that was due to his wrist surgery. The second season of that deal, he was hitting .296/.345/.407 and leading the NL in doubles when he was hit by the pitch that broke his arm.

Stupid part is he's outplaying Schwarber, Almora, and Heyward, but is still a bench player.

OK so 1 awful season and 1 of his average seasons. Point still stands. He likely wouldn't be here after free agency.
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Re: Game 85: Marlins @ Cardinals, 7/6/17, 12:45 pm

Postby R27 » Fri Jul 07, 2017 2:04 pm

Even though he probably should be. The ability to consistently average is greatly underrated. And underappreciated.
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Re: Game 85: Marlins @ Cardinals, 7/6/17, 12:45 pm

Postby chevyman58 » Fri Jul 07, 2017 9:09 pm

No reason to think he wouldn't be here, he'd have been much, much cheaper than Fowler with similar skillset. The big FA deal he got was 1-year/$8M. What's predictably prohibitive about that?

Gyorko was acquired as a bench player. Big deal. He's grown into a regular because our signed regulars have sucked (or if some prefer because MM has ruined them). Him not being here would be no loss, we could have missed the postseason & then been a buncha games under .500 at the AS Break just as easily without him. He's won us nothing, zero, zilch.

I think I'll resurrect the Jon Jay Fan Club. Bring him back Mo!

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